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clearskies
12-07-08, 11:58 PM
I have noticed lately some postings in a number of threads talking about Death... What are your feelings and beliefs towards death?

Does it just scare you then you try to forget about it or avoid thinking of it?

Does it make you work more and get more of life?

About myself, I try to avoid it. I do not attend funerals. But when I think of it unconsciously, I wish I have more time to do good things. I also hope if there cd be anyone who has been there and came back to tell us his expereince with death.

I also think of imaginary fictitious ideas such as using Artificial Intelligence, machines and MPs to pentrate one's brain to know what he feels while dying and convey for us what is it like..

Strangely, when I was married, I always said.... ((oh Goodnes... how foolish I was!, I am saying that to myself now))..... I always preferred to resort to the feeling that my ex will protect me against it . Now, I became more mature to depend on myself only even when facing the idea of death.

DoesntMatter
13-07-08, 12:08 AM
The fact that people are mortals and die makes life all the sweeter and more interesting. To me, the worst thought of death by FAR is the thought of my parents, sisters or dog dying. I've personally almost died twice, once was right after I was born and another time I almost drowned in my aunts pool when I was 4, which I still remember well. My big sister and uncle saved me :D

All my grandparents are still alive, but the youngest of them just turned 82. My oldest will be 91 in February. It will be very sad when they die, but at that age, everyone in my family knows they lived long and fulfilling lives that couldn't have been any better. And all good things come to an end. Death just caps off a long streak of good times, and to me their deaths should be a time to also celebrate the good lives they lived

When younger people die... Well, that sucks

clearskies
13-07-08, 12:15 AM
Wise words DM, it is logic to expect the death of old people. I only felt bad to hear about ur pool experience..you were too young (only 4) but you can still remember it well... How amazing is the human mind!.
Do it keep good memories the same as the bad ones?

DoesntMatter
13-07-08, 12:20 AM
Yeah I remember stuff from when I was 4 (and maybe 3) easily. I only know I was 3 or 4 because the memories were from my old house, and I moved to the new one when I was 4 and a half

I almost drowned when I slipped through a tube when I was in my aunts pool (I couldn't swim). It was just me and my sister in the pool at the time. I remember being at the edge of the pool and trying to climb the wall but it was smooth and I couldn't, I was looking up at the light coming through from the top of the water and trying to climb but couldn't. Apparently my sister asked "Where's Michael?" and my uncle dove in the pool with his clothes and everything and got me out before I drowned :D It never turned me off from water though

misombra
13-07-08, 12:23 AM
i just try to be happy, and positive, and strong. i don't listen to anything that sounds like bad predictions. "you'll never make it," "you'll have it forever," "you'll never recover," etc. don't ever listen to those things.

and to tell people how i feel about them and make the most of my days.

we're only immortal for a limited time.
YouTube - Rush - Dreamline - Live 1994

clearskies
13-07-08, 12:25 AM
Excellent, you learnt afterwards how to swim without drowning. Good for you..
It happened for me once when I was a little girl but it was in the sea. Someone near me took my hand and pulled me out. I cant remember my age but may be I was 7 or 8. In my late twenties, I started to go to swimming pool at my Uni in the UK and started to swim. I am OK at the pool but in the sea, noway.

Illusional
13-07-08, 12:29 AM
basically, it's inevitable.

raverboy

clearskies
13-07-08, 12:30 AM
Misombra: I can't hide the fact that I have fragile feelings. Hearing the death of someone, even if it was a death/killing in the TV/Radio news of someone I do not know or ever heard of , I just feel bad. It might also spoil my day and I try to forget it else it will haunt me for sometime. It is the same like seeing a car crash, although there may be no blood or injured pple around but I cant forget it for a while... oh my!

clearskies
13-07-08, 12:34 AM
basically, it's inevitable.

raverboy

True Indeed... People might think good health prevents death... but as you said it is a destiny and no one can stop it...
Did anyone of you have a serious car accident that left him thinking he was about to die?

misombra
13-07-08, 12:37 AM
clearskies, i heard a rumor that, based on history, that this thread could face the wrath of death...

is it true?

clearskies
13-07-08, 12:40 AM
First time to hear about it... is it like a Candy man curse for example?

Illusional
13-07-08, 12:42 AM
nothing will prevent death.. you are just putting it off with good health.

raverboy

boobaa
13-07-08, 05:29 AM
All people should die. And I am going to make this happen. **** yeah.

anachronistic
13-07-08, 05:40 AM
Death is like a goodbye; it's the end of something, but maybe not the end of everything. Plus, you shouldn't be thinking about the goodbye. You should be thinking about the conversation.

clearskies
13-07-08, 05:46 AM
What conversation? cd u please explain more? Did you mean conversion state from life to death? :)

boobaa
13-07-08, 06:11 AM
I am curious too. Maybe he means the kind of motives like Indian people do, happy funerals.


However, to speak my mind, I think this aspect lies more in what the person was like, what he/she achieved, what you achieved with him/her and what was left unfinished. I have lost quite some people, and to this day I think: how they died, were they relieved or died with unsolved life, or from a miss?

I know there might not be an afterlife, and human body is just the body, a chemical compound, but still, as I live in presence, i do think about what was that persons last thought. I don't live in another life, nor in the past, i live in presence, and when someone is missing, I may miss.

miSSleepy
13-07-08, 08:10 AM
The conversation, as in the LIFE; not the death (the goodbye). It's a metaphor.

Personally, I can't imagine simply not BEING. That scares me. Even while asleep, you're still somewhat concious of the fact that you're alive...but just not existing ...

A few times I thought about it accidentally. One time I was in bed just thinking about what the world will be like hundreds of years from now, really deep in thought, and then the idea that there will be no me or anyone I know hit my like a sledgehammer and I literally went into a short state of panic like I imagine I'd feel on the verge of actual death. It was weird, and it only happened to that extreme once.

Recently, my friends sister and her boyfriend were killed in a very bad car crash and I've seen two really bad accidents on the road and those things scared the crap out of me too. Cos I'm thinking, her sister and the boyfriend, how are they any different to me and my boyfriend? They probably got into the car the same way we do, drove down the same street we would, had the same conversations and hopes and plans and if it can happen to them ...

That's just of late though ... usually I'm more worried about people I know dying, but I think that's just the human thought process of "it won't happen to me"

anachronistic
13-07-08, 09:10 AM
Death is like a goodbye; it's the end of something, but maybe not the end of everything. Plus, you shouldn't be thinking about the goodbye. You should be thinking about the conversation.


What conversation? cd u please explain more? Did you mean conversion state from life to death? :)

I really hope, that since I spend so much time to type this out, that you do not delete it, so that other people can read :)

I was being analogous, clearskies :) When you say hello, a conversation is born. When you are born on earth, your existence is new, just as new as the conversation. Sometimes people anticipate the endings of things... in many cases, that is death; it's perfectly understandable. Death is something that is very hard to accept. To say goodbye is the death of a conversation... it is the end of a moment.... and in many ways, it is like actual death.
You know, as a human, you are consciously aware of yourself... you are given this through physical senses... and the presence of mind. And with all this, you are able to foresee through observation of the beautiful things around you, anything that might happen... and you make judgments, and based on those judgments, you make choices. This is all common sense, no? :) Well, we foresee death the same way we anticipate the end of the conversation; for example, we feel the need to experience certain things and to achieve certain goals, before we die, so that we can be remembered, so that there is no remorse if you are aware when you might die, or any reason that you might have. The same is with a conversation; you are (maybe unconsciously for you, but very consciously for me) constantly thinking about what to say next, how you should end the conversation, all while realizing you really don't want to end it (presuming it is someone you really like to talk to, possibly your life's love, since assuming that you don't want to die, you really enjoy life) And the reason you do this, is so that things are good... so that he/she might think about you when you go your separate ways, and so forth. It's all anatomical to death, don't you see?

My solution to this has been for a while, and will be until I find a better way (I haven't found one yet), to just live the moment. To live without judgment, and to make choices without. The ability to do so, will allow you to enjoy the conversation better (it really does, and the same lesson can be applied to life, I can honestly say out of years of experience) And not only that, but you will not be at a loss of words. You will be true to yourself and everyone you talk to. You will be void of human impurities.

You see, the way I always viewed it... is that animals are impure... and everything they do is based solely on their instincts... and I have always until recently considered people that I don't like as animals... but now, the way I see it, animals are perfect. They do not perceive death, and therefore they enjoy life. How could it be better any other way?

Unfortunately, because I am a human, and we are humans, we are separated from them by being able to perceive... to have emotions and morals and everything... we will never be as perfect as animals. But we can use them as our example, and just live for the moment. Dedicate yourselves to what you enjoy (note, this is the paragraph hinting that I am not suggesting anarchy, or chaotic behavior, for those of you who are really immature)


I am curious too. Maybe he means the kind of motives like Indian people do, happy funerals.


However, to speak my mind, I think this aspect lies more in what the person was like, what he/she achieved, what you achieved with him/her and what was left unfinished. I have lost quite some people, and to this day I think: how they died, were they relieved or died with unsolved life, or from a miss?

I know there might not be an afterlife, and human body is just the body, a chemical compound, but still, as I live in presence, i do think about what was that persons last thought. I don't live in another life, nor in the past, i live in presence, and when someone is missing, I may miss.

Well, I am not relating it to the indian ways. I am not an indian. I am all kinds of people, from all over the place.

I think you're on the right track, Boobaa... or that you at least have a similar mindset to my own.

I am an admirer of monogamy, and it's always hard to give up those people that you like. I am not saying that will ever be any easier. But you do have to accept that as a part of life, all things die. Death is not the way of life. There is an ending for everything. When you finally accept this, you will find that life is much easier to live.

I don't know if you ever searched through the forums or not, but I grew up in a poor home without my father around. My childhood is one that many consider 'tough' and 'unimaginable' and all that. It was tough getting through, and I even had to have visits with a psychologist to help me straighten my life out. But this post is not about me.. I just use parts of my own life to help other people understand that it can be done a better way. That's what advice giving is, right?


The conversation, as in the LIFE; not the death (the goodbye). It's a metaphor.

Personally, I can't imagine simply not BEING. That scares me. Even while asleep, you're still somewhat concious of the fact that you're alive...but just not existing ...

A few times I thought about it accidentally. One time I was in bed just thinking about what the world will be like hundreds of years from now, really deep in thought, and then the idea that there will be no me or anyone I know hit my like a sledgehammer and I literally went into a short state of panic like I imagine I'd feel on the verge of actual death. It was weird, and it only happened to that extreme once.

Recently, my friends sister and her boyfriend were killed in a very bad car crash and I've seen two really bad accidents on the road and those things scared the crap out of me too. Cos I'm thinking, her sister and the boyfriend, how are they any different to me and my boyfriend? They probably got into the car the same way we do, drove down the same street we would, had the same conversations and hopes and plans and if it can happen to them ...

That's just of late though ... usually I'm more worried about people I know dying, but I think that's just the human thought process of "it won't happen to me"

It sounds like you are holding onto a lot. That's why it's so difficult for you to face death. I hope you get something from my post MiSSleepy.

And unfortunately, I am expecting all kinds of rude, immature comments, so don't disappoint me this time, loveforum. Fire away! :)

miSSleepy
13-07-08, 09:21 AM
I do feel like I'm holding onto alot ... but also there's a lot I feel I need to do, as cliche as that sounds. At the moment it feels like I'm a standstill, just waiting ...

anachronistic
13-07-08, 09:41 AM
I do feel like I'm holding onto alot ... but also there's a lot I feel I need to do, as cliche as that sounds. At the moment it feels like I'm a standstill, just waiting ...

I know exactly what you're talking about :)

Check out some of my posts in the isolation thread. I think they may help you discover something about yourself.

I did post something in the Idol thread in the off topic section. It seems as though everyone ignored it... anyway, the meaning behind that post, is to help others become self-inspired. If you are inspired by the people around you, logic says you will only be as good as them. If you are self-inspired, and you reference to others' works, you will approach your 'problems' in your own way.

There's a saying... "The journey is what brings us happiness - not the destination" In this, one should do to enjoy, not to do and accomplish. Enjoy what you do, Missy :)

By the way, I've posted it before, because I thought it was a good book and movie; The Way of the Peaceful Warrior by Dan Millman. They label it as 'self-help' but it is really a great book, with a wonderful story, and I wouldn't call it a self help book. But you do learn a lot from it, and I recommend it to you.

IndiReloaded
13-07-08, 09:58 AM
Lol, LW, you've been listening to Ajahn Brahm again. ;)

BTW, you are wrong about animals not being able to make predictions. There's a beautiful study on (monkeys, I think?) where starving animals were given a choice between taking food or not if it meant a companion gets a nasty shock. Very significantly, these animals did NOT choose to take the food, even tho very hungry.

anachronistic
13-07-08, 10:06 AM
Lol, LW, you've been listening to Ajahn Brahm again. ;)

BTW, you are wrong about animals not being able to make predictions. There's a beautiful study on (monkeys, I think?) where starving animals were given a choice between taking food or not if it meant a companion gets a nasty shock. Very significantly, these animals did NOT choose to take the food, even tho very hungry.

The only sound clip of 'Ajahn Brahms' I have ever even listened to is the one you shared with me. Honest to god. I'd say Eminem has more of an influence on me than that guy does, and I don't even listen to his music!

My posts sure must concur with his stuff, since you're assuming this?

Could I have links to these studies, if you have them? Maybe books I could read? I am very interested in that type of science, and I would enjoy nothing more than to spend time reading it.

By the by, I did not mean to make any scientific claims in my post. Just using metaphors to explain how I get by. But I do enjoy your scientific and religious debates :love:

IndiReloaded
13-07-08, 10:12 AM
The only sound clip of 'Ajahn Brahms' I have ever even listened to is the one you shared with me. Honest to god. I'd say Eminem has more of an influence on me than that guy does, and I don't even listen to his music!

My posts sure must concur with his stuff, since you're assuming this?

Could I have links to these studies, if you have them?

Its pretty standard buddhist philosophy, the whole detachment thing. I was into for a while when I was younger, but listen to enough talks & you start to realize that their 'answer' isn't really an answer any better than what else is out there. There are many paths.

http://www.bswa.org/modules/mydownloads/viewcat.php?cid=4

There are other speakers, but his are the most amusing, IMO. I've met him, BTW & while he is pretty benign, his groupies are a scary lot. Anyway, the index is searchable by topic & also alphabetical. The newer ones are better audio quality. Enjoy.

anachronistic
13-07-08, 10:22 AM
Ahh, now I see why you're referencing him. That whole detachment thing... I was into that for a while, too. Just like you... in fact, only within the last few days have I come up with this philosophy... where you live for the moment. Still not completely thought all the way through, actually.

I was not referencing that buddhist philosophy in my posts, though. :D

And groupies? I had no idea that Buddhists were some kind of rockstar. You know I am only kidding with that, but if you were curious, I do not believe in any congregational religion. My philosophy is that people should get out there and find religious answers for themselves. You can follow any religion, but you will always question things. Maybe I will make a thread dedicated just to taht topic huh?

And world views form. They shouldn't remain the same. Just like people change, so should their views ;) otherwise, what are they learning?

IndiReloaded
13-07-08, 10:48 AM
only within the last few days have I come up with this philosophy... where you live for the moment. Still not completely thought all the way through, actually.

I was not referencing that buddhist philosophy in my posts, though. :D

Its called 'present time' or present moment. Its the core of all meditation, LW. Releasing attachment = present moment awareness.

Which is not the same as nihilism, btw.

IndiReloaded
13-07-08, 10:51 AM
And groupies? I had no idea that Buddhists were some kind of rockstar. You know I am only kidding with that, but if you were curious, I do not believe in any congregational religion.

Yes, I too find it distasteful (the Monk-as-rock-star thing), letting go of ego indeed, lol.

Which is why, despite the fact that some of buddhist philosophy comes closet to how I live my life, it still gets that "Discard as Religion" stamp from me. Those ppl are being herded as well as any Catholic/Islamic/<insert religion here> sheep I've seen.

Mbe instead of a school, I should be starting a religion.

anachronistic
13-07-08, 11:01 AM
Man, my being of loveforum needs to be flushed away for a while... I've practically spent the whole afternoon on here. Time to get work done!

You and your silly 'white knight syndrome' ;) I am referring to your feeling the need to make a school and religion.

Don't worry about the religion part, Indi. I've got a set of philosophies that I just might publish, which do not have such problems. All I need to do is organize them. :)

Great minds think alike, right? Cheers. Something does need to happen with education. It's all about money nowadays. So it seems. I had an interesting conversation with my step father. I will PM you about that, though :)

IndiReloaded
13-07-08, 11:04 AM
Holy cow, I feel like I am being herded here, lol. My school idea was just that... an idea...

I'm gonna retire in 10 years. No way I'll be running a school unless its a floating one on my sailboat, kids. Feel free to run with the idea if it appeals. :)

anachronistic
13-07-08, 11:22 AM
Am I overwhelming you with my tidbits of knowledge, love? :love:

Lipp
13-07-08, 01:12 PM
I believe that death is the end of it, no reincarnation or after-life or spirits or such, once your mind and body calls it quits you're finished and there's nothing left of you but the corpse.

I don't really think about it, nor worry, I just make sure that I sort out the unnecessary risks since I'd hate to die young, still got a lot ahead of me.

Occasionally it can be a good motivator to take some risks (not life-threatening, but life-changing) since you only live once and should make the best of it. Probably part of my fear of being stuck in a crappy city with a dead-end job and all-in-all living a dead-end life.

DoesntMatter
13-07-08, 10:09 PM
Which is why, despite the fact that some of buddhist philosophy comes closet to how I live my life, it still gets that "Discard as Religion" stamp from me. Those ppl are being herded as well as any Catholic/Islamic/<insert religion here> sheep I've seen.

Hmmm, that's too bad Indi, you should be more open minded :surprised

boobaa
13-07-08, 10:27 PM
Lol, LW, you've been listening to Ajahn Brahm again. ;)

BTW, you are wrong about animals not being able to make predictions. There's a beautiful study on (monkeys, I think?) where starving animals were given a choice between taking food or not if it meant a companion gets a nasty shock. Very significantly, these animals did NOT choose to take the food, even tho very hungry.

Who the **** made a cruelty like this? What happened to the animals afterwards?


Anyway, I was thinking of lucid dreaming today, and how some people claim to have seen the future. It reminded me an awful big deja vu I had in the work one day.
So I did research and found that birth and death is accompanied with large doses of DMT what your brain produces. DMT is also present when one is dreaming. I could tell that its just a hallucigen, but since some people see the future and have huge dejavus, maybe it is something more? Got to extract it from somewhere, maybe I can get to the other side.

DoesntMatter
13-07-08, 10:35 PM
Some of my friends have done DMT. Apparently it's the most intense trip ever and just amazing :D

anachronistic
13-07-08, 10:39 PM
Yeah, depressing that people 'care' enough to shock animals and starve them just to see if they can predict something. Might as well read about it, since it's been done though... right?

boobaa
14-07-08, 02:51 AM
Yeah, depressing that people 'care' enough to shock animals and starve them just to see if they can predict something. Might as well read about it, since it's been done though... right?
I guess that 'might just reead about it' stuff was sarcasm. No?

First of all, if a man spends enough time in nature, he wouldn't need such a test.

I don't care if something is left undiscovered or some fat dude dies in skin cancer, just don't do animal testing, thats nazism.

Aegis
14-07-08, 02:54 AM
I kill deer and pheasants and rabbits. Caribou in Quebec sometime this winter, if I get l lucky.

IndiReloaded
14-07-08, 06:21 AM
Who the **** made a cruelty like this? What happened to the animals afterwards?

They all move to Hollywood & become extras for movies like 'Over the Hedge', boobass.

IndiReloaded
14-07-08, 06:22 AM
Hmmm, that's too bad Indi, you should be more open minded :surprised

I gave religion a chance, DM. Did the whole church as youth, sunday school, etc. I even have relatives who are clergy. It failed miserably, sorry. I simply see no utility for religion in my life.

Tone
14-07-08, 10:48 AM
boobaa I hear you man.

It's sad that for as far as we've come as humans... all the advances in technology and medicine... the world would be better off without us.

Mish
14-07-08, 11:44 AM
On the subject of death. My ex's mum had a book called "Death, the final orgasm".

IndiReloaded
14-07-08, 01:57 PM
Death is like the closing of a book. Now, a more interesting question to me is What Kind of Book Am I?

Mish
14-07-08, 10:27 PM
Death doesn't bother me because I don't think about it

Though, I remember I freaked out once. I was in bed with my ex at night she was sleeping. I looked at her, I looked at me, I looked at the house and thought in some 100 years this house will proly still be here but her and me will be lying buried underground somewhere.

I believe if you think about it long enough you can go crazy

DoesntMatter
15-07-08, 12:19 AM
Naw, I think if I thought about it long enough I would join the Army or Marines and bring death to assholes trying to kill me

anachronistic
15-07-08, 01:51 AM
Anyone seen grumpy/grumpier old men? Burgess Meredith was so hilarious in that movie. A lot like my own grandpa :)

zoso
15-07-08, 04:44 AM
I don't want to think about myself dying. I don't want to think of all the things I could have done and should have, the friends and people I will miss, how short my life was, etc... It's just depressing, and not worth it.

I just like living... as should everyone :P

One thing to add:
I hate funerals... but not because I get teary-eyed and whatnot, I just hate seeing dead bodies. (as in open-casket funerals.)
It just feels so unnatural to look at this empty shell of a person.... ugh!

DoesntMatter
15-07-08, 04:51 AM
I hate funerals... but not because I get teary-eyed and whatnot, I just hate seeing dead bodies. (as in open-casket funerals.)

lol, my grandma took me and my sisters to an open-casket service when we were young because she thought it was good for us to see a dead body :D

clearskies
15-07-08, 05:08 AM
Ohh that scares me DM.. I didnt attend the funeral of my uncle while i was home. Luckily enough my granny died while i was abroad..I really dont know what I am going to do if one of my parents will die, i will be away and not sure what is to be done. Better forget about that for now at least...

IndiReloaded
15-07-08, 05:23 AM
I don't worry about my death. I care more that, right now, other ppl need me. But no matter how you look at it, once you are dead you won't care.

DoesntMatter
15-07-08, 05:25 AM
A life sentence is definitely worse than death. Prison gives people slow rotting deaths